Big Red Flix 16: The Avengers Part 2 (SPOILERS!)

Welcome back for the spoiler-filled part 2 of Dave, Jitterbug and Yoshifett’s review of The Avengers. Again, there are spoilers, you have been warned. Check back on BRB next week for another exciting episode of BRB Flix!

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  1. Excellent podcast again guys.


    Though I am amazed that Jitterbug didn’t bring up Hulk’s sudden ability to be controlled by Banner with little reason given for it.

  2. Tomohare

    Great podcast, as always!

    Diarmuid said
    Though I am amazed that Jitterbug didn’t bring up Hulk’s sudden ability to be controlled by Banner with little reason given for it.

    I thought that too.

  3. zombieboy

    Love the opinions on this show

  4. WarMachine

    Superb show again guys I quite liked Captian America’s personality as a contrast to the rest of the team. Maybe I am not detail orientated enough to pick up on it but Captian America’s shift to spy for me was just him making sure that shield was not starting to become America’s version of hydra in regard to the weapon development aspect. While hawk eye was the only avenger to be sucessfully enslaved by loki (at least temporarily) I believe he was using the staff to try and split them apart as the scene shows. If he was not directly controlling it he probably knew what type of effect it would have on them being in such close proximity to them.


    I think that hawkeye should have been killed in place of or in addition to the agent. I found him to be an under developed character as from the thor movie he was just some random assassin and in the Avenger he is a shield agent/elite agent who spends most of the movie as loki’s slave. I felt little attachment to him as a character but it would be clear why black widow and nick fury would have some attachment to him and if he was killed then it would drive them to avenge him. I would have enjoyed it better if hawkeye was replaced by a better character maybe War Machine (in case you can’t tell I am a fan of the character) or another avenger. Regardless it did not really drag the movie down for me just that slot on the avengers being better used would have further improved the movie.


    I reckon they missed an opportunity to use the super charge effect thors lightening had on Iron man during his fight with him in the final battle. It could have been a cool way to get Iron man out of a difficult situation. I found the jonah thing with Iron man to be quite funny and creative. I think his armour showed a bit more battle damage afterwards but I am not certain. If they had killed a significant character/avenger then I might have believed that Iron man could have died at the end. It is pretty obvious that they would not kill him though as Iron man 3 is coming out, he was probably the best character in the movie and I would be quite suprised if he was not in Avengers 2.


    Jitterbug, I agree that a human vs human story would have been better and it would have added tension and drama to the movie. It was an amazing comic book movie and aside from that it is a fantastic and hilarious action movie which I am considering watching again in the cinema (which is rare for me) and it will definitely be in my DVD collection (I do not have a bluray player yet).

  5. Providence

    Awesome, but I disagree completely about Iron Man. You somehow turned a blind eye to that movie’s shitty stuff, the only reason it was a more coherent film is because it was able to focus on a single hero, there are too many to follow in this one, and yet Joss made it work. But both Iron Man and the Avengers are fun, not serious action movies. And of the two, this was superior in both fun and action.

    Remember the last fight with Jeff Bridges in Iron Man and tell me that was not stupid (worst part in my opinion)

    Anyways love the cast, just remember your nitpicking isn’t limited to the movie you’re talking about, but also the ones you compare it to. Also it’s hard to take Yoshi’s critic-mode seriously knowing he can watch and enjoy the prequels. Just sayin…

  6. Varik

    Diarmuid said
    Excellent podcast again guys.


    Though I am amazed that Jitterbug didn’t bring up Hulk’s sudden ability to be controlled by Banner with little reason given for it.

    Are you referring to his ability to turn at will or that the hulk fought alongside the avengers, in the latter case he does not control the Hulk as he’s a separate personality. The fact he fought the Chitauri rather than the avengers is down to who started a fight with him and who didn’t. There should have been a line added in any case, possilbe including the word “Friend” in it.


    Watch Hulk Vs, you can see the hulk wreck all of Asgard. Fury also points out that the hulk is stronger that Loki.

  7. Saw avengers for the second time on Sunday and I HAD to post!

    No hate here guys, I get you liked it but you might notice that some things become clearer on your own second viewings

    1. On Loki’s staff and it’s sudden power to affect the cube? It’s powered by/linked to the cube, Banner and Stark say so earlier, and they were actually using it to track the cube. “Fun Fact” it also looks like the staff also how Hawkeye and his band of merry mercenaries were able to find the cloaked Helicarrier. This is why it’s able to break through the IMPENETRABLE SHILED around the Tesseract later
    2. As for why Loki didn’t he just go round jabbing everyone in the chest with it? No one let him get close after Fury warned me is my guess!
    3. If you do see it again the voiceover at the beginning (which I totally forgot about after the first time) is by the Chitauri number 1 to….the um …spoilers guy at the end of the credits. That’s what their deal was throughout. They were just workin’ for the man who would “court death” (although on my first watch I thought it was a generic Skrull). This is also backed up by the staff induced flashback thingy (which I’ll admit was pretty bad exposition wise) where Loki was reminded who he was working, for and what he was doing. Loki’s a pawn, hence the relatively easy take down.
    4. On the “overpowered superman problem”, I think when you see it again you’ll see the Hulk is consistent. He gives Thor a bloody nose early on (By Odins Beard!) and Loki sets up Asgardian power levels and his own fate when he tell Thor that “they think us  gods, brother” bit before “dropping” Thor off.   
    5. On “X” dying.. Yes, it’s not a great cause to rally around however could you honestly say that you would expect ANYONE to die in this? I didn’t expect it in a DISNEY movie, so I’ll admit, I was a little taken aback that anyone died, even if it was someone of so little stature;)
    6. As for the..,LOOK can I just say spoilers? They are already IN the cast? No? Well just in case, you know that thing where that guy does the noble sacrifice thing, and is woken by a joke, to quote the cast? Whedon can’t really kill any of these multi-million dollar icons, not yet not until we are well and truly sick of them in Avengers XXVI, so he’s gotta concentrate on the journey he can put these guys through, even if he has to put them back in the toybox for the next guy who comes along, so for the sacrifice thing, it’s nicely shadowed earlier by another character saying to that guy that he’d never make that play. He made that play. No way they were going to throw away merchandising though, so he bounces back. I thought it was nice foreshadowing. Maybe on a second viewing you’ll agree.   

    Finally I can’t believe that none of you didn’t nit pick at what the hell Thor was doing in that cornfield the whole time? Did he pop out for a coffee?


    Keep up the good work!

  8. Providence

    Well spoken sir. I agree wholeheartedly with nearly all of that.

    I say the style of the review should reflect the style of the movie. This movie isn’t a slow methodical collection of buildups, it’s a fun ride that doesn’t blow it’s wad too quickly, and maintains healthy balance of characters while not delving too deep into any one aspect of film-making. This movie should have been reviewed like Ricky-Oh style.

    Usually I nitpick just as much, this time I was able to chill, I know they were too, but I suppose if Dave, Jitter and Yosh just hi-fived each other over how great it was, that would make for a pretty lame flix episode. They could have gone ‘goodfellas’ just a little though, for the sake of how awesome this movie was.

  9. Cory

    About Captain America’s change in character, he was never one to always blindly follow the government. Sure he was the all-American poster boy… but when he was nudged in the right direction by someone, he ignored what his superiors told him.


    Again, you’d have to watch Captain America to see this. At first he follows the orders of his superiors, but he was kinda persuaded to go off on his own and save the people by that one chick officer that he never gets to hook up with. (don’t remember her name at all).


    This time in Avengers, it was Stark that gave him the push. He’ll never always blindly follow orders if he’s suspicious of something else or has good reason to disobey.


    Also, with Loki’s staff, remember the entire middle portion of the movie, Loki was prisoner and the staff was kept away from him. Once he escaped, he never had a chance to use it against the Avengers again until has his talk with Stark.

    He was also too busy setting up the portal to make an army. He also had a superior army, so he might not have felt the need to convert a mass amount of people. The main reason Loki wanted to rule earth was to get back at Thor.


    Another point, Loki was never deemed a powerful god. He was always the manipulator. Without the staff, he wasn’t that strong. His powers were manipulation and illusion. It’s fitting that he himself was manipulated by Thanos. It also helps to better understand Loki’s motives if you’ve seen Thor, in which he was also the main villain.


    I really enjoyed Fury’s character on the floating ship. Despite having no super powers, he was determined to hold the bridge. And it was pure gold that he pulled out an RPG to stop one of the jets from taking off and bombing Manhattan. But yeah, Hawkeye should have been killed. That would have been better because it would have to be one of the Avengers to do it and they’d plant that blame on Loki for turning him against them all. But then again, they couldn’t have shown the cool bow scenes. That weapon was awesome! On the other hand, Black Widow could have then used the bow, “in memory” of Hawkeye.


    And finally, how can you hate Loki? Just look at his smile! That alone makes me love that villain!

  10. OOO, forgot to mention in the podcast how idiotic it was that a thump on the head is what brought Hawkeye back to his senses. I thought I was watching the Three Stooges for a second!

  11. WarMachine

    Jitterbug said
    OOO, forgot to mention in the podcast how idiotic it was that a thump on the head is what brought Hawkeye back to his senses. I thought I was watching the Three Stooges for a second!

    I did not get that either but I ignored it as I found the rest of the movie so enjoyable. I am not sure waht the best approach would be to restore Hawkeye (Clint?) to his pre-enslaved state. Maybe being shown key points of his shield career to remind him of who he is. if that method was chosen it might make hawkeye seem like a useful character instead of being quite useless in my opinion.

    Jitterbug, how would you have handled his restoration better?

  12. marcopolo177

    Tbh I’d have to give a nod to Whedon on how he portrayed Hawkeye in the beginning at least. In the comics he started out as a bad guy and in the movie he gets enslaved to do Loki’s bidding and while doing some damage to his teamates. I would only say his time of redemption was a little too late to get to know his good side.


    Speaking of Coulson, they introduced the Life Model Decoy in the movie so he can have chance to come back and basically nobody can die now. Maybe they can showcase Fury, Coulson and the rest in a Shield movie. Since there are alot of agents who are more than just gun soldiers. But it looks like Guardians of the Galaxy is gonna be the next new movie after the big 3 get their next sequels.

  13. archangel

    Just saw the movie again last night. I must say I was surprised by a couple things, mainly how flat the Agent Colsen death scene felt on repeat viewing. Maybe it’s because of all the feedback I’ve heard since first seeing it but this time around it did not resonate emotionally at all. Guess at that point it’s a problem of character development, though I will say following all the previous movies does help to give you an emotional attachment to the character since he is the only constant staple throughout all the movies sans Captain America. While I do agree with Yoshifett that the movie should stand on its own, watching the previous ones added greatly to my enjoyment simply for the fact that an ensemble like this will only work without all the character exposition and development bogging down the beginning, which you could argue still partially occured.

    Lastly, what a difference it made seeing it now as opposed to midnight opening night. It was definitely better seeing it in a packed house full of nerds. I kept wanting to shout “Don’t you people get this? This stuff is hilarious and awesome!” Oh well, guess I’ll just have to wait for Rises. Longest two months ever…

  14. As far as how to handle Hawkeye’s return better, they should’ve used it as an opportunity to help us learn something about that silly staff. It plays such a central role to the movie, arguably even more so than the tesserwhatever cube. Thwopping Hawkeye on the head to magically make him get his senses back like Fred Flintstone after a stint with the a martian isn’t good storytelling.

    Perhaps Banner could’ve put his knowledge of Gamma radiation to good use (since that plotline got dropped nearly completely anyhow) and offered up a ray gun that he’d built in the past to try and stop himself from turning into the Hulk. The gun could affect the Gamma radiation residue left by the staff, which then leads the crew to realize that anything the staff creates (like the forcefield at the end) could be affected by something that is condensed with gamma radiation. Thus, when the end comes and the characters use the staff to break the shield over the portal, it would make sense.

  15. Barachel

    Hey guys, just wanted to say that I was getting caught up on episodes of Flix, Blue, and Boom, and was overjoyed to hear Dave’s melodious voice for all three episodes! Thanks for all your hard work on the shows! thumb

    As for this episode, I’m not gonna hate on Yoshi and Jitterbug for criticizing The Avengers. I know they liked it, and when you look at Whedon’s achievement and all the things that could have gone wrong, and have gone wrong in movies that have tried something similar with big casts, I can overlook some missteps, especially when it’s so much fun!

    Love you guys and can’t wait for Fight Club!bigsmile

  16. Lynx_Lapdance

    I especially liked the bits with explosions and fighting. Was a romp with some fun jokes.

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